Jobcentre Plus Labour Market System
Post Categories: DWP • Flexible New Deal • New Deal • Welfare Reform • uk government
Tags: Actively Seeking Employment, direct gov, Employment Officers, Flexible New Deal, jobcentre Plus, jobcentreplus.gov.uk, jobpoints, Jobseekers Direct, Labour Market System, LMS, National Minimum Wage, New Deal, new deal jobs, New Deal Personal Advisers, Work Trial
New Deal Scandal exposes the scam that is the Labour Market System (LMS) or simply put the pool of jobs Employment Officers, New Deal Personal Advisers and Jobseeker Direct staff give to jobseekers as Jobseeker Directions and those on the jobpoints and the direct gov and jobcentre plus websites.
Employment Agencies
Jobcentre Plus’ Labour Market System is controversial in being a spamming ground for recruitment agencies.
Sometimes as much as 1 in 2 jobs are advertised by an employment agency – the job doesn’t even exist and it has been known for the same job to kept being relisted in later months.
Many jobseekers (myself included) have applied for such named jobs and never heard a response back…. ever!
There is absolutely no reason why Jobcentre Plus couldn’t allow employment agencies to advertise alongside real vacancies or on the jobpoints.
New Deal Jobs
We had recently an article on here about the New Deal Jobs where you had to ring up Jobseekers Direct to even apply. These aren’t actual jobs, just an invitation for a select few of doing a Work Trial (keep benefits don’t get paid anything by employer) lasting 30 days with a potential job at the end – but not guaranteed.
Immoral Jobs
Jobcentre Plus are happy to advertise immoral job positions as long as they are not illegal. Well, there is no law stating that Jobcentre Plus has to accept any or every job just because its not illegal just like employers are not required to advertise jobs to the Jobcentre.
I thought the Government were trying to do something regarding young girls (in particular), drugs and prostitution as highlighted a few years ago. I think the jobs in question are too close to prostitution as after they have lost all sense of moral self-respect (something that is generally lacking in society these days especially with unemployed people who can become depressed because of their situation) so when they get their benefits stopped with a 6 month sanction and have bills to pay… it wouldn’t be an unlikely option to choose.
Anonymous Jobs
A lot of advertised jobs on the Labour Market System (LMS) only mention location, hours and description without mentioning the employers’ name so jobseekers are unsure of whom they are applying for at the first instance without phoning.
“Ring Jobseekers Direct” Jobs
Sorry, but having a big system (Labour Market System (LMS)) as a central location for jobs which can be accessible in numerous different ways… doesn’t it take the point away of how 1 in 3 jobs now require a phone call to Jobseekers Direct to apply for them?
Surely, the jobcentre website, direct gov job search and the jobpoints are designed as a self-service way of seeking jobs to apply for?
So why then do you have to phone up to apply when the information could so simply be displayed like normal to the jobseeker? It is so it can be recorded on their file as a Jobseeker Direction!!
Guess what?! Most jobseekers avoid applying for those jobs, so it isn’t surprising how these days many employers stick instructions of how to apply in the description so they don’t have to ring up the below number.
Lets think about it… you are down the jobcentre, you wait to get to use a jobpoint… you print out a few jobs you want to apply for and then you have to wait again to use a telephone, a telephone full of germs from those who don’t wash their hands after the toilet or other activities, and have to shout our your National Insurance number, name and address so everyone can hear… fraudsters paradise? Oh, and thats after having to wait in a long telephone queue.
This is all so some little Hitler can try to sanction you. Lets think about it, besides from jobs you are given when you sign on or by your NDPA, if you find a job on the jobpoints or the website, print it out or write it down, phone up another number (this all before actually applying in writing or ringing another number) where you actually find out more information… how likely is it that such a person isn’t Actively Seeking Employment?
Closed Jobs
All jobs stay on the Labour Market System (LMS) for a year; they aren’t displayed after the closing date.
So, why do some jobs that have already been approved that have not reached the closing date then disappear from the system? This rather takes the point away of having a job reference number displayed on the advert.
Distant Jobs
The website search features pick two different types of matches: relevant that are green, and pink which are irrelevant. I am not questioning the pink jobs… although rather pointless, but how are some “green jobs” so far away?
Maybe it is just me, but my search today showed some green jobs… Cambridge… Colchester…, Hadleigh… Chelmsford, … all fair enough, Southend… pretty far, London… can be just 1hr 5mins by train so fair enough, “Kent Area”… rather unrealistic, Lincoln… unrealistic too…
Then the pink ones of Leicester, Newcastle, Glasgow, Devon, …. Stowmarket… Sudbury
The last two are closer than Southend… whats going on?
Shady Jobs
Wage:- “GREAT” (see FEE/22048) – where is the numerical figure?
My definition: OK/alright is minimum wage… “good” is £1-1.50 more an hour than NMW; “very good” is £3 plus more than NMW; “great” is £10+ per hour.
Salary:- “pro rata” – I always felt this was misleading, it means how much money you would get if it was fulltime … but its a part time job!
Many jobs have tracking codes in the email addresses… aplitrak.com all the recruitment agencies are using them i.e. Dave.5425.682@agencyname.aplitrak.com I am rather unaware of the technology used but what I have read so far could violate privacy, as appears to be some sort of mailing list system.
Discriminative Jobs
Please see the below example:
Job Title SHOP ASSISTANT – LEP ISF/37612
Location
IPSWICH, SUFFOLKHours
30 HOURS PER WEEK, MONDAY-SATURDAY, BETWEEN 9AM-8PMWage
MEETS NAT MIN WAGEWork Pattern
Days , Evenings , WeekendsEmployer
GrandstandPension
No details heldDuration
PERMANENT ONLYDescription
This Local Employment Partnership employer shares information about new starters with Jobcentre Plus, for statistical purposes only. See www.dwp.gov.uk for more information. Applicant must be 18+ as serving alcohol. Previous experience is essential. A driver’s licence is essential and a car . Duties include customer service, cash handling, and stock replenishment. A trial period of 6 weeks is required before a full placement can be offered. Exempted vacancy – Employment Equality Act (Age) Regulations 2006
How to apply
You can apply for this job by telephoning 01473 225473 ext 0 and asking for Chris Sudeene.
- Why does a shop assistant require a driving licence and car?
What part of working in a shop (appears to be an off licence – not sure why they never mentioned it) requires a car and a licence? The shop is on the outskirts of town of on of the largest roads in to the town centre from the West of the town. Has bus stops both side of the road very close to the shop and many bus services use the road. Plenty of ability of a car share getting dropped off into the town. Those close by can even walk to work and back. Duties doesn’t seem to include any specific activity such as delivery from the wholesalers. After all its a shop assistant probably at the National Minimum Wage – surely the shop has a manager who would be getting stock delivered? - A 6 week trial period? Full placement?
I thought it was a job not a work placement!
Labour Market System: the summary
Designed to be the primary tool of the jobseeker and from my own experience the less successful avenue to seek employment, the Labour Market System is heavily flawed – it might as well be abolished. Every job I have had and all the interviews I have had were from jobs found in the jobs newspaper, in shop windows, and on other internet sites.
To recap…
- To create the illusion that there are a large job market in existence employment agencies are allowed to advertise decoy jobs to fill the system up while the agencies themselves are allowed to cherry pick certain people into unrelated typically zero hour contracts
- Quite a few jobs are very shady and even possibly violate privacy of the jobseeker
- A lot of jobs adverts close early prior to job closing date, rendering reference codes pointless
- Immoral jobs are included for diversity reasons
- Jobs are typically over discriminative requiring driving license when the job involves office work or retail or of similar discrimination.
- The dodgy jobs with companies of bad reputations never disclose their name (includes agencies) requiring contact to Jobcentre Plus’ Jobseekers Direct line to find out information. The jobseeker therefore can’t determine whether or not a job violates their conscientious objections etc… until they have been submitted to them, so they are likely sanctioned than having to appeal
- Some jobs require you to be able to work for nothing for a months trial if you are unfortunate enough to be on New Deal, trying to gain an chance of getting a job at the end of it without guarantee
- Majority of jobs now require the jobseeker to ring up Jobseekers Direct to enquire about a job rendering the jobpoints and website search as pointless; well the intention is to force all jobs as Jobseeker Directions
- Then some jobs are far too away to get to!
So, lets take the scenario of a typical 18 year old on the dole…
- Searches the Jobpoints… straight away filters out the Distant Jobs (sadly LMS system can’t do that)
- Ignores the employment agency jobs (due to experience of no success with them)
- Has self-respect so doesn’t consider Immoral Jobs
- Doesn’t want an agency spamming inbox with fake jobs…. thus doesn’t apply for such (Shady Jobs)
- Ignores the jobs which doesn’t mention who the employer is
- Finds a job which sounds good and prints out the advert (chances are at home the reference code wont no longer work, which means cant apply for)
- Is not on New Deal so can’t even request more information on the 7260+ annual jobs that are New Deal Jobs, and when on New Deal has to sit in a classroom for 30 hours job search for 13 weeks
- Doesn’t bother ringing up Jobseekers Direct as is aware of the reasons why they want the jobseeker to, plus chances are having to wait to use a phone and in a phone queue; doesn’t want benefit sanctions
- Find a decent job… but oh wait, doesn’t have a driving license (even though old enough – in case someone mentions that lol) so can’t even work in a shop…
Any wonders why there are one million unemployed young people?
It doesn’t stop with these people neither, affects all jobseekers!
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He should make a complaint about them to HMRC:
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/nmw/complaint.htm
17 hours @ NMW = £98.60 – so he was basically on 1/2 the National Minimum Wage.
Considering you require SIA certification to do the job he shouldn’t have been on NMW anyway – although there is no law stopping it and at this times you cant picky (unless a better job exists out there).
.-= *** Last post: Flexible New Deal Providers set to defraud Government *** =-.
Do you have details of the job so I can investigate?
It isn’t difficult for someone like the Jobcentre to distinguish between a resident address and a business address; after all, one pays council tax and the other business rates.
Pub raises many suspicions – although its a new-age thing where one-2-one interviews might be out and about (typically at a coffee shop etc.) but this is usually for second interviews. Some employers may also do like a team building activity approach somewhere.
Generally no interview takes place at pubs, bars, nightclubs typically anywhere alcohol is.
Might be some lonely person wanting a date I dont know. lol
Well… my main concerns are with safety (we can all say however that the interviewer(s) are strangers) and your personal information…
I am concerned that the information given to apply for jobs is enough for identity fraud to take place. This reminds me as being similar to the old recruitment agency scams (rented office somewhere).
You should request to see your credit rating.
My experience with my (local?) Jobseeker Direct service is after waiting to hear the annoying speech (who would have thought it? Jobcentre Plus part of the DWP! lol) etc. is they wont talk to you without you giving your N.I etc. and they will hang up if you refuse and try to get around it. Jobseekers Direct is meant for claimants of Jobseekers Allowance thus as you are a slave you have to tell them. maybe its different where you are.
Yeah, don’t expect any encouragement… funny how they think that however I had problems telling my NDPA that my biggest barrier to employment was unemployment. I think they thought I was having a laugh at their expense. Took a good 10 minutes for the NDPA to accept the reason as “length of unemployment” (or something on those lines). Trust me, don’t under estimate employment… I would say you are probably 10 times more likely to get a job if you already have one then when you are unemployed.
Interesting, glad it was of some success!
Apparently, jobseekers are meant to chase up every application and CV they send out. I think it is generally a good idea to follow up invites to an interview, a rejection letter (for feedback if it is prompt response) and of course accepting any job offer…
However I think chasing every application submitted is a bit much…
“Hi, Can you give me some feedback as to why my application was unsuccessful? Thank You”
“Sorry I don’t deal with the recruitment side of the business”/”We offered the job to someone more suitable for the position who is more qualified”/”I don’t have any applications here anymore so I don’t know if we even received it”
Also, did you use a DL envelope (fold into 3), C5 (fold in half) or C4 (not folder at all)?
Apparently some employers get upset when spec letters are sent in anything other than a C4 envelope.
Hi Andy
Yeah the media doesn’t seem interested in anything, so I am left to investigate these things. hehe
Did you hear about the local job paper being moved to a Friday? Might not apply to EADT. I mean, surely friday has to be the worst day to advertise jobs, hardly any business (admin/HR side anyway) operates at the weekend.
I personally not had any success with the LMS system, all jobs I have had and interviews I have been invited to were from newspapers, spec applications and other websites.
I have however had numerous issues when Jobcentre Plus has tried to sanction me resulting from the LMS.
They change sign on times regular throughout the UK.
The submission limit?
Well, the Decision Makers Guide is a very strange guide, so don’t expect to be guaranteed “good cause”.
DMG 34592 states sanctioned can only apply if they are reasonable.
DMG 34607 reads (I will quote):
Of course you can’t really prove if there was over 100 applicants but if you can prove that there were over 99 submissions alone by Employment Officers you stand a good chance of securing “good cause” status.
i have encountered what the term is “adjudication officer” telling lies about information submitted,when this was counter claimed i was quickly awarded the decision.
secrecy is their key telling the clerk at the job centre to not let me see the paperwork on the phone in front of me.
this is all tribunal material,however it rarely get to that stage once the heat is turned up.
jonathon they obviously think those on that course lack basic literacy and numeracy skills thereby thats why they cant find work and obviously ignore anyone like yourself who obviously isnt illiterate
my ndpa tried on several occasions to imply that i couldnt read and write and tried suggesting i go to adult literacy classes prat he couldnt even spell properly when typing up interview outcome on the computer i refused point blank pointing out that having done a library assistant qualification this surely proved that i was able to spell and read properly and reading and writing is a core skill for working in a library thats the trouble with these people they come out with these things but they never step over the threshold of the library from one years end to the other whats the betting he still reads the beano!
ps no offence but seriously is spelt this way not the way you have spelt it